I have discovered Alison Krauss from Hungary

[akusgal41790]

Btw, avenaoat, love Chopin! My favorite composer in all of classical music.

[tal]

I think you guys are turning the subject backwards! As I understood it the question was not why do Americans not dance to dance musik but why do they not dance to bluegrass!
And I remain with the view that most of Bluegrass is not dance music( most! Not all! )
It is either way to fast or totally inappropriate to dance to!
Why do people not dance to Beethoven's 9th? Or Bach's cantates? Or to this
www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wpPk8qk3uQ

Here are 2 examples of Ralph Stanley and I dare anybody to dance to either!
www.youtube.com/watch?v=4adxe5N6Ato
www.youtube.com/watch?v=xpxuh090IUc

But I am sure if you do this
www.youtube.com/watch?v=pEF8IFRXkD4&feature=related
to any of these examples, yes you can dance to it and if I am not mistaken every bluegrass fan will heartily thank you for doing that! ;D ;D ;D

Btw I do believe there is plenty of slow dancing being done to some of AKUS's tunes though!

[akusgal41790]

Perhaps, but it was brought up, nonetheless.

While 'O Death' might be a tricky one to get loose on, a lot of music coming from the mountains at this moment has kids and family dancing to it. So maybe these specific numbers are not things one can dance to, but people certainly can figure it out with other numbers in bluegrass music.. it just may not be 'popular'.

As for classical music, things such as Tchaikovsky's piano concertos or Mahler's 4th movement of Symphony NO.5 would be lovely and easy to dance to. Bring in Beethoven's 5h or a Fantasie of Mozart to a party, and there would be a problem.

It could be the 'pop culture' of today that does not encourage dance to things such as classical or bluegrass. Maybe if they became genres much of society listened to, we would instead be talking about *how* the people are moving to it. But clearly, Ralph Stanley and Mozart are not in the majority at this time. Looking at things like Footloose or those old musicals, people were dancing because everyone was dancing, everyone was listening.

[avenaoat]

Kind everybody

I see I brougth an exciting thing in the USA. I want to think over some ideas about the American folk dance and the difference between the USA and Hungary (1970) (not political, dictatura versus democracy, but cultural). I will be a little long.
First of all I will answer to my European Community's fellow.
The mayority of the Hungarian folk music are not good for dance, like a part of the American folk and folk root music. 2 examples:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=YnRyEz17Q9w
www.youtube.com/watch?v=_dshXqFATsA&feature=related
And there are a AKUS song clip, where some people dance:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=2P7J1_hZ7iM
I wrote first half of the XX century 2 great musicians and folk music reserchers (Béla Bartók, Zoltán Kodály) bound the Hungarian music cultur to the folk music. between 1958 and 1990 the Hungarian music teaching in the schools was based on the method of Kodály, like this time there is the Japan's. I began my schools in 1963. The effect of this was so strong, that one of the 3 great rock bands in Hungary (Illés, Metró, Omega) in the end of the 60s the 1/3 of Illés's music origined from the Hungarian folk music (Unfortunately I was Omega fan). The dictatura built cultural centers in the towns and bigger villiges and the cultural managers were taught in the universities. For 1970 György Martin and others collected the Hungarian folk dances and folk dance musics in the Karpatian Basin. Enthuastic and brave students and young graduates began the spontan dance house movement with assisting of the young cultural managers in the cultural centers. I wrote earlier first the dictatura did not like this movement, but Kodály and Bartók's spirits and some vise cultural experts helped the movement, for example random György Aczél (cultural dictator) was took to the dance houses unexpedly, he settled there and he allowed the folk dance in the schools. (The dictaturas do not like the spontan movements, because the people are uncontroled). From the school came children who like the folk dance. Let's go to USA. I think there is not dense cultural centers with assisting cultural managers, therefore you are right the young generation lost for a similar movement. However there are schools and highscools, here a movement may be started.
I wrote this consists of 3 equal pillars: 1. folk dances 2. live folk musicians 3. I think this would be important the the preindustrial costums. Why do I think it is important. From the XVIII century to the XIX century were nice costums in the Western World and I think in America. The girls and boys could wear this nice costums in festivals, dance performances, competitions, etc. There are a museums in Hungary, where the museum makes a family dress in XVIII century costums from the children to the parents, and the tourist go through the museum like Mozart and his wife and their children, but you have to book this 1 week before.
And LIVE MUSIC! I do not live in the mountain region of the USA, I do not know the schools, teachers, pupils and the parents of the pupils. I do not know it may be similar thing in montainous area. If a movement started and reached the highscools copmetitions would be. The final competions could visit the folk music root bands and stars to populizare the movement for the other parts of the USA.
You are American, you know your own homeland, you know it may be in the USA something similar.

During writing I listened to Restless non stop, but I am not boring.

Avenaoat

Bay the way, latin name of oat is Avena Sativa.

[eyesoflove]

There actually is a style of dancing that goes in conjunction with bluegrass called flatfooting and LOTS of folks do that at our shows when my band performs. It's similar to clogging. I'm not exactly what a "dance movement" would be, but flatfooting is very common at bluegrass shows and goes along with the faster tunes like "Foggy Mountain Breakdown" or "Rocky Top." The bluegrass shows of old used to include dance numbers and comedy routines. Some groups like Dailey and Vincent incorporate the tradition of comedy routines, but in a different way. I can't recall ever going to a bluegrass concert/festival without seeing some flatfooting. It's a type of dance that goes best with the traditional bluegrass sound, so AKUS stuff may be too progressive for flatfooters.

[eyesoflove]

Avanaoat,

Here in the US, the bluegrass culture is very much a small one, so the majority of the high school students out there would not be the slightest bit interested in the music or the folk dances that would accompany it. Interest in bluegrass is concentrated in small pockets throughout the US, but it isn't a widespread thing. In fact, the vast majority of Americans have never even heard of Alison Krauss, especially prior to her teaming up with Robert Plant, and she is one of the more prominent names within bluegrass.

[avenaoat]

Kind Eyesoflove

I understand you. Yes the USA a young country, the tradition is not too much role in their culture. You are a little community in the USA music life. However I think you know the way of saying to give more pleasure than to get something. I would be glad, if other folks do similar thing like my homeland did. I do not know Werther somebody gathered folk dance's choreographies in the USA. I am wonder, when USA is full of colleges and universities if nobody did this.

avenaoat

[eyesoflove]

Some colleges have classes or studies devoted to folk culture. There are also a handful of folk schools that teach different trades such as basket weaving, different music classes, pottery, etc. For whatever reason, it's largely a culture that is more fascinating to those outside of the US than those within it. Japan, for example, has a huge following of bluegrass and the culture, as does Canada and parts of Australia. In many ways, America is quite ashamed of the Appalachian region and doesn't have very kind views and most Americans negatively stereotype us. Most people who don't appreciate bluegrass have an inability to appreciate the skill that is required to actually perform bluegrass music. They hear twangs, banjos, and a bunch of hillbillies and can't even appreciate the mastery of the instruments. For the most part, America is just a society that glorifies big money and demeans Appalachian culture.

[tal]

Akusgal.
Like I said, not all bluegrass music is unfit for dancing. Like Eyesoflove points out there is dancing just like you can waltz to Strauss but not to Beethoven's 9th.
My point is that to turn music that isn't dance music into something that can be danced to is a fallacy IMO!
Personally I love musicals ( though not the same period you like) I am a big Astaire/Rodgers fan.

My main point is really that I believe in the natural progression of music and not in a forced "modernization" or "change" in order to get more people to listen to it.
At the end of the day when I listen to my favorite music I want to be thinking "Wow I love this music".
Not "Wow a million people also listen to this music" !

Avenaoat.
Thanks for completely ignoring my response to your idea's!
Btw there is a movie you might find interesting. I do not know on how much truth the basis of the story rests but nevertheless you might enjoy it! It is called "Songcatcher" and is about a professor who goes to the Appalachian mountains to collect the folk songs of the region.

[akusgal41790]

Like I said, not all bluegrass music is unfit for dancing.

I realize that, and I was agreeing with you.

I didn't say that music should be changed in order to have a bigger fan base, only that the *reason* there is not more dancing within these genres is because they *aren't* popular, being a reason for probably many not even knowing about the kind of dancing that was just mentioned.

Eyesoflove, I enjoyed reading your response on the US culture seeming more appreciated outside of the country. Very true IMO.

Side note: I love musicals of every decade! I spend a ridiculous amount of money seeing it all. lol. I mentioned the 50s, and I think Astaire was popular then as well. As an overall musical dancer, though, still love Gene. Enjoyed the two together in Ziegfeld Follies!

[avenaoat]

Kind Tal

We Hungarians were lucky to revival the folk dance culture with the folk costumes. However for example the Irish people have same folk music and folk dance life like in Hungary .

avenaoat

[tal]

Avenaoat.
Yes they do but they also have even more popular folk music they don't dance to but just listen to!
I would say it is my impression that folk dancing in Ireland is also confined to a rather small traditional group where as their folk music is a living thriving continuation of traditional folk music and something you might hear in any pub!

[tal]

Akusgal.
I have always seen the question Gene or Fred as on par with the Beatles or the Stones!
If forced to choose I'd go with Fred and the Stones anytime over Gene and the Beatles myself!
I find the Beatles too "soft" and Gene too ballet like for my taste. Though I am sure I am offending some people deeply with that! ;D

And true, Fred was still active in the 50s but for my money his best work was pre that time!

[eyesoflove]

I think that, all in all, those who are most steeped in and appreciative of the bluegrass culture wouldn't wish to sensationalize by including something that's not really an intricate part of its history. It's not that people don't dance at all to bluegrass, but the dance isn't what defines the genre or the culture. To promote it by adding to it wouldn't really be promoting what it truly is.

[tal]

LOL! Eyesoflove. THAT was exactly the point I was trying to get across but put way more succinctly than I did!